Final episode of the Food Justice Season: Another philanthropy is possible

We are excited to present to you the long overdue final episode of our season on Food Justice! And trust us, it is worth the wait :)

Our current global food system is highly unequal and unsustainable and, compounded by conflict and climate change,  hunger has risen sharply over the past years. We have heard in previous episodes how farmers, communities and movements are building sustainable alternatives like agroecology. What can funders do to address the broken food system and truly support those on the frontline to create systemic change? Join us for this episode to learn more from one of the most groundbreaking and loving funders: Thousand Currents.

We speak to director Solomé Lemma about her drive to address inequalities in the global development and social justice space by changing who is funded and how they are funded. By putting communities and movements at the centre, supporting them longterm and flexibly with money and more, and taking other funders on board. We hear about the amazing work of women farmers organizing in West-Africa and how Thousand Current navigates these challenging times.

After hearing in earlier episodes how farmers organizing, corporate power campaigners and feminist researchers are pushing the boundaries in a challenging context, this episode is a heartwarming conversation on what can actually be done to help movements build towards a just and sustainable food system.  

"We believe we can have a world that is just, that is good, where everyone has access to the resources, livelihoods, and agency they need to live self fulfilled lives. That world is possible."

"And we also believe that people who are most directly impacted by the barriers and challenges that are getting in the way of that world are best positioned to actually solve them."

Learn more about the work of Thousand Currents:
Their website https://thousandcurrents.org/
LinkedIn account and email sign up form

 

Full transcript below image of the conversation Barbara had with Solomé.

People vs Inequality Podcast – Season 4 episode 4

“Another philantropy is possible - funding movements for food justice”

With: Solomé Lemma (director Thousand currents)

Barbara: Welcome to the People vs. Inequality podcast. This podcast is a space to reflect and learn with change makers on how to tackle inequality by diving into the choices they make and the, and the obstacles they face, but also the hopes and dreams and making real change happen. My name is Barbara van Pasen and I'm the host of the People vs Inequality podcast. And we've been on a bit of a break for various reasons, but here we are with the final episode of our fourth season of Food Justice. When we started this journey, the world was trying to grapple with the reality of yet another food price crisis and growing hunger. And I'm afraid things aren't looking a whole lot better, but people are doing great work and there's plenty to do. So after hearing from farmers about their movement building, a campaigner on challenging corporate power and a feminist researcher on how to, how to leverage research to shift power. I'm keen to reflect on what we have heard about why the food system keeps failing and what we can do about it. And not unimportantly, how to resource and support this essential work for food justice and food sovereignty that is so heavily underfunded. I'm very excited to speak to the director of one of the most groundbreaking and loving funders, at least in my humble view, Thousand Currents. Solomé Lemma has a long history of diaspora organizing and shifting power in philanthropy. And it wasn't easy to get a spot in her busy agenda. So please grab a coffee or tea and listen in on the conversation. So welcome Solomé, it’s really, really great to have you here.

Solomé: Thank you so much for having me, Barbara.

Barbara: I really appreciate you taking the time and I know you're super busy and you've been traveling a lot. So I just want to check in, you know, um, how are you doing today?

Solomé: Thank you. Thank you for asking. Um, first of all, apologies. It's been so hard to find time during this end of year hustle, but I'm today. I'm doing well. I'm doing okay. These times are hard as you know, and I'm grateful to be able to find small joys and small connections every day through my 8 year old son or family or community here. So I'm holding up okay. I'm holding up good today.

Barbara: Thank you. Thank you for sharing that. Also. I think it is often in these things that we. Also find courage to keep going. So thanks for that. Um, yeah, we always like to start the interview with hearing a little bit more about who we're speaking to today. Um, and kind of what you're, how you ended up doing what you're doing, basically. And I know this is a big question, but I'm curious to, to hear a little bit more about who is Solomé and how did you end up at Thousand Currents?

Solome: Thank you. Um, well, hello, everyone. My name is Solomé Lemma, as Barbara said, and I'm with Thousand Currents right now. I've been in the CEO role for about six years now. And for those who don't know, Thousand Currents, we'll talk about this more, but Thousand Currents is an intermediary funder that supports movements working for food sovereignty, climate justice, and economic justice for joining us. And in my story, I think you started to allude to it in your introductions. I am originally from Ethiopia, and I came to the United States when I was 11. And I think that experience has had a significant impact on why I do what I do right now, coming here at the age of 11. One, I left home with a sense of responsibility, even though I was young around, I want to do something back. I'm going to come back. And this was 1990. And then I came to the United States with a sense of optimism, right? I was proud of where I came from and who I am. And once I started school in 6th grade. The questions I got from my peers were all about the famine in Ethiopia. Were you hungry? Did you eat? Did you have a home? How did you get here? And I think that really impacted me because I realized, even though I didn't have the language for it at the age of 11, That there was a severe misunderstanding of Ethiopia in particular or Africa in general, and I think that continued to cement this idea of wanting to do something good, right?

Um, even though I didn't know what that pathway would be and, and I kept pursuing it over the course of my life through my academic studies, focused on international development, and then my work experiences. And I would say, One of the experiences that really mattered for me, in addition to kind of my migration story is, in school I worked in Liberia at one point on gender based violence. And this was in a rural community, and I was working with women who were returning home from a life of refuge, and they had some really exciting ideas about what they wanted to do to rebuild their lives, right? The kind of work they wanted to do, the kind of businesses they wanted to start that they were excited about. And I, and we couldn't support their visions because our funding was restricted. We could only do what we had funding for it. And I think that was the moment where I said, Oh, what would it look like to actually sit on the side of the funder or the one providing resources? If communities aren't able to enact their own changes under their terms, then what are we doing?

And why am I in this industry to begin with? And that's what began my foray into philanthropy, was that question and that experience. And when I finished school, the first job I got was at a grassroots funder called Global Fund for Children, which was an incredible experience working with grassroots groups across Africa, working on children and youth issues. And that experience also sparked another question, which was, Who is a funder? Why do we just rely on Global North communities and Global North funders, mostly white, to think of them as a resource? And how do we reframe this narrative of Africa that is, that was prevailing at that time as this continent of need, a beneficiary, right? And yet at the same time, especially at that time, Diaspora communities were contributing billions, close to 60 billion a year in the form of remittances, which were going to many of the things that philanthropy actually supports if we really think about it at a collective level. And so I left Global Fund for Children to really explore diaspora philanthropy, which then brought me 2000 Currents through a joint partnership, then a merger.

Barbara: Wow. Yeah. Thank you so much, um, for that. And, and also, I mean, kind of, I've been studying you a little bit, of course, before this conversation. Um, and it's, it comes across so clearly this frustration with a system that is, I mean, really not putting those who have, who are on the front line, who have the knowledge, who have the solutions in charge, um, of, of basically their own destiny and their own solution. So, and that's something that's come across, I mean, in this. in the, in the various series of this podcast. And it's a podcast about inequality and we talk to people trying to tackle inequalities and those same people are faced with a massive inequality when it comes to the ways they're being funded and the restrictions that they bring.

So I'm so excited to have you here, um, talking about these issues and really diving a little bit into, okay, what does that, that mean, um, uh, from the experience of Thousand Curtains, uh, primarily, but also maybe other things that you see happening around you. So maybe that brings me to, um, the, the work that you do as a thousand, as Thousand Currents, and I guess maybe the, you're, you already alluded to it, the change that you're trying to create with that work. Could you tell me a little bit more about that?

Solomé: Absolutely. You know, I think at the most basic level, we believe we can have a world that is just, that is good, where everyone has access to the resources, livelihoods, and agency they need to live self fulfilled lives. That world is possible. We don't have it right now, but it is possible. Um, a world where nature and communities thrive together. Um, and we also believe that people who are most directly impacted by the barriers and challenges that are getting in the way of that world are best positioned to actually solve them.

And as you just mentioned, the problem is they don't get the resources that they need. And that's why we at Thousand Currents support grassroots formations and movements in Asia, Asia and the Pacific, Africa, Latin America and the Caribbean, all of whom are working for food sovereignty, climate justice and economic justice. And we know these issues are deeply interconnected. we don't live in a world of silos.

And that this is Transformational change. We're talking about addressing root causes and root conditions so that people can finally live free and thrive under their terms. And we also know The Metrics of History shows us that fundamental changes in society have taken place because of movements and communities organizing, fighting for it, and building the worlds that they envision, from abolition to civil rights to all kinds of movements to the decolonial movements and so forth.

People and communities working together has always led transformational change in society. And we are in this current moment of multiple overlapping challenges from the climate and ecological crisis to our crises and democracies to economic inequalities and so on. And we believe that once again, it's people in communities and movements doing the work that's going to set us free, that is going to solve these issues.

And that's why Thousand Currents really prioritizes partnering with funding, supporting, enacting solidarity with grassroots groups and social movements. And this ties directly to even kind of one of our thematic areas of work, food sovereignty, right? We know that there is enough food, there can be enough food to feed the world, and that peasant farmers and smallholder farmers are feeding the world and they're able to sustain and feed the world.

But right now, they're not able to control the production, consumption, or even distribution of food. Um, and they're not getting enough food under their terms because of the dominance of industrial agricultural model. Um and because of that, they're getting very little resources and support right despite the work that they're doing. That multi sauce across so many areas they're able to feed people. They're able to do so in a way that's ecologically sound and works in harmony with nature in our environment. They're able to build community power. They're able to build cultural survival and so forth. And yet, They're not supported to be able to do so at scale.

And so at Thousand Currents, we work to change that. We provide resources directly to movements working on these issues. And we also know our resources are not enough. And this is actually feedback we got from our partners that you're not enough. You need to educate and organize your community of funders.

And because of that, we also work to influence and organize. Um, philanthropy. So, um, in short, we, we make sure movements and communities have the resources they need directly through our grant making work and also directly through our donor influence work.

Barbara: Yeah, and I think that's really interesting because I also often hear that back when I speak to, movements and, and people in organizations trying to really shift things on the ground that, they want more funders to do that kind of, you know, to approach it that kind of way. Can you say a little bit about, um, First of all, maybe why you think that isn't happening as much as we'd like to because it's not a new thing, right? And I think this is also something that, you've said in the past, like these are not entirely new conversations. although maybe some parts are, I'm also curious to hear your thoughts. But so why, why is it so hard for funders to do that? Maybe this is a double question, like where are we at today? Um, and why aren't we, why aren't more funders doing this?

Solome: Yeah, that's a great question. and it is true. There's increasing commitments for climate funding, right? And even those commitments aren't necessarily reaching grassroots community led climate solutions, right? Less than 2 percent or so are going to those solutions to begin with. Um, but, but there is increasing and promising commitments. And I think one of the opportunities and challenges we have for those of us working at intersections is showing how food is a climate solution and, it's not separate from it. And I think one of the biggest challenges that philanthropy has is it's a sector that really operates in silos, that has independent portfolios and streams, often even those portfolios. And people aren't talking to each other in the same organization, let alone at the field or sector level. And so we really need to de-silo to show that. Food solution is a climate solution. Agroecology doesn't just feed the world. It actually tends to our soil. It actually helps us sequester carbon. It actually is a mitigation and adaptation strategy. So I think we need to kind of continue to make the case, um, around that.

But the barriers to why resources aren't reaching communities and movements. That's a big question, right? In so many ways, and I'll try to answer it in short if I can, or at least touch on some points. Um, I think on the one level, we need to kind of look at the roots of philanthropy, right? If we kind of look at philanthropy as a whole, in its background, it is, in many ways, many of the resources are rooted in systems and practices that have extracted or exploited others, right? And then that money is moving through philanthropy to do more good and more just and philanthropy and international development in general have also been rooted and hold on to some colonial narratives about particularly about people in the global south, right? Approaches have been top down, right? Externally driven there in these countries. Right? Conditions of poverty or inequality because they don't know what they're doing. So we must send in our technical experts. We must send in our people and we must send in our resources to save them from themselves. And while we've made significant progress and really trying to shift that narrative in so many ways, and now within the development space, localization is taking form or shape as this new agenda.

And then within progressive philanthropy, this idea of trust based, solidarity based philanthropy, which are all promising. That root is still there. We haven't completely eradicated. And in some ways, it creates a tension, right? And that philanthropy is a tool and a tactic for us to do good in the world. And that good is to invest in long term visions and strategies that bring about, ultimately, less dependence on philanthropy or perhaps even the end of this kind of industry, right?

And these are not just strategic questions, right? These are also kind of really important kind of ethical questions we have to grapple with that gets to the issue of what are the barriers. And because of these top down, externally driven roots, in many ways, there's a sense of belief that communities and grassroots groups and movements one, um, operate at a really small level, right? So when, so that they can survive on small grants or small funding because they're small in size and impact, which is a misconception. Second, there's this idea that they don't have absorptive capacity. So even as increasing resources are flowing into the sector, they're not coming into groups that are working with ground up strategies because of this idea that they can't absorb the funding. But truly no organization starts out with 100 million dollar budget. It's because funders took a risk on them and invested in them, and what would it look like to do the same for communities and grassroots groups? And we're not doing that. And we're not doing that because we have some implicit biases around, like, how can they manage the money? Do they know how to do it? Is it trustworthy? And so it's really rooted in these beliefs in Um, kind of mental models that need to be dismantled as well as practices that need to shift right to show that grassroots groups do scale. They may not scale in the way that a funder understands it, which is this one singular organization growing their work and having this national level impact. But they scale through these distributed, decentralized, yet interconnected models of change and impact that is both local and national and global in nature. And so really kind of working through what are the misconceptions that exist and how do we. How do we reframe them and really transform and change them?

And so that's a long winded answer, but I think, in many ways, the barriers are philanthropy's own misconceptions, um, more so than anything else.

Barbara: Yeah, that's really interesting, those misconceptions and biases. And actually, there's some parallels with the debate around food, food sovereignty and that also came up in earlier episodes similarly about smallholder farmers, and I think you alluded to it as well, there is these ideas that there's no way these, these are feeding the world because I mean, they're just, you know, it's already in the words. They're small farmers, smallholder farmers. Um, and so these narratives come up a lot.

Um, and I think that's also something that, um, yeah, I'm actually curious, what role do you see for funders like yourselves when also trying to influence, um, the ecosystem or other funders, uh, when it comes to challenging some of the narratives, both around funding as well as around a specific issue like the Like food sovereignty that your partners are working on.

I think we play a critical role. And I think that's why it matters that groups like us, Thousand Currents, Grassroots International, Green Grants, and many others, exist because I think we play an important role in educating and organizing donors, but also in And moving resources directly, right?

So the role we play is both practice, but also narrative shift, communications, education and organizing. Um, and that's truly why I think Thousand Crimes exists as an organization from our very roots. We were started almost 40 years ago in 1985. And the entire reason we started was because, at that time, the Bretton Woods institutions, the IMF and World Bank were dominating the international development industry and approaches, right, through structural adjustment programs and so on.

And our founders said, we've got to do something different. We've got to do, find a way of getting resources directly to communities. And that remains equally as relevant today, even as conditions are shifting. Um, and, and, and, and we do that work and we work to shift philanthropy by first practicing different approaches, right? And so, we make a strategic choice about who we fund to make a point that resources do need to go to the ground, to people that are actually doing the work that matters.

Um, Secondly, all of our funding is unrestricted. Um, it's completely flexible. One of the challenges that communities have is not just, it's not just getting the resources they need, but it's also when they do get resources, they're usually so restricted. It's kind of asking them, you know, tying their hands in the back and saying, go change the world. It's impossible. And so our resources are unrestricted and the majority of our resources are long term. We accompany partners for at least 10 years and about 10 years, um, because these kind of systemic challenges obviously take time. So I think our approach in and of itself is, is a model for what kind of practice we need in philanthropy to shift power and philanthropy.

Um, we also know it's not just about the money, it's about the accompaniment. And what partners say to us again and again is we, We deeply appreciate the financial resources, but you're also a strategic partner to us. You're also a political partner with us. This is solidarity work, right? And so it's all the wraparound support we provide and engage in, including learning exchanges, convenings, spark grants, emergency support, travel support, facilitating connections amongst our partners with funders and key strategic spaces or policy spaces. They may want to be. Part of but doing all of that work is also how a practice that we're trying, we're enacting and also using to change philanthropy.

And then lastly, is the donor organizing and education work, right? And, and, and that work doesn't happen individually or independently as Thousand Currents and takes, as you said earlier, many of us do, and we are just doing this together and bringing on many other donors to the table. Um, but for 1000 Currents, it has meant starting 1000 Currents Academy, which is a training program targeting individual and institutional donors, um, in a week long learning around how to engage in solidarity giving with Global South movements.

And we do this every year. Every year and then for 10 years and it's still needed and we have to keep doing it again and again, but it's our way of recognizing that as an organization as an intermediary that raises money to move money. Our work is not just the transfer of resources, but it's really shifting conditions. So that eventually, we are not even necessary.

Barbara: Yeah, thank you. That's so, I think that's so great. Um, both in terms of the way you fund, which really is honestly everyone's dream that I speak to. And I think I saw a blog with the title, move more money, ask less questions. And I thought they captured it quite well. Um, and also the academy, really taking people on that journey and, and investing time in those relationships. Um, it's, it's very impressive. I'm wondering, because you recently visited some partners in West Africa and I was wondering if, if you want to share a few things of maybe what struck you there, like what, what is that actual work happening, you know, on the ground that, that is possible because of this experience. And quote unquote, free money.

Solomé: It was amazing. We were in Senegal, and we actually visited, one of our long term partners that we've been with for eight years. They're called Nuson we are the solution. I don't know if you've heard of them. They're phenomenal. They were kind of founded in 2011. Um, and it's a movement, right, within West Africa, made up of 500 rural women's association from Burkina Faso, Senegal, Guinea, Gambia. Guinea Bissau, Mali, and Guinea, um, and they are incredible, they are truly powerful. They focus on using and promoting traditional food sovereignty and agroecology, right, practices, um, across the full spectrum.

And there were so many things that struck me. I'm like, where do I even start? I think I can make two points. Um, the first thing that struck me overall, um, in that I find powerful is their organizing model. Right. And how it goes quite deep. It is rooted in community. It is composed of 500 women's association and each association is truly vested, embedded in community and in a village.Right. So how deep it goes into community and how wide through their network model, through their organizing model. And that is scale. Right? That the barrier that philanthropy uses not to fund groups, this is what scale looks like. It's scale that is localized, that is contextualized, and that's impactful, right?

And they have over 200, 000 women that participate in this network. Talk about scale, right? And impact. And so I knew this, I've read about this, and it's still striking when you see what it looks like in real life, um, in community when you're breaking bread with them and having a conversation about what this network means to the women in it.

And the second thing that struck me is the level of scientific innovation and experimentation that goes into practicing and advancing agroecology and agroforestry, right? Um, they, our funding is completely unrestricted and they get to determine how they use it and they just, they used it to build this pilot Research Center for Agroecological Practices, where other farmers, other farmer movements, educators, students, everybody from an undergraduate to a PhD come to learn at that center.

And I was blown away because you see the full spectrum of agroecology from, From seeds to planting to to harvesting and production and and and sale and at every step of the way, there's a rigorous, intentional analysis, research, experimentation and documentation and unfortunately, we don't talk enough about that when it comes to our smallholder farmers. Right. We don't talk about how they are biologists. They are scientists. They are doing the work through, through lived experience, historical experience, and in real time research and analysis. And so everything from how they may import a particular plant and localize it all the way to how they tend to their poultry and the natural organic, Methods that they use to their bio fertilizers and protective measures, I was blown away right by the level of rigor that goes into it. And rigor is not a work that we often like and are part of the world or the work, but it's also one that I often see this book. This discipline, this commitment to practice, to getting it, done right, um, across all of our partners and, and the experience with Nous Sommes La Solucion, was no different, the leader of the organization right now, Mahima said to me, or what she said to us, as she was speaking to us, um, she was telling us about how they had a hard time planting a particular tree and eventually they realized it's because they hadn't actually tended to the soil health. And so they found different ways to tend to the soil health and now it's thriving. And in that comment, she said, you know, it was really hard. We made many mistakes and we had many failures, but that's why we are the solution. And so we are called the solution. We will do what it takes to get it right. And that was really powerful.

Barbara: Wow, thank you so much. Yeah, the commitment and the passion, I guess, also, I mean, really comes across. And, and what you're saying about, I mean, it's really cool that they, that they, um, took up setting that, setting up that kind of scientific space. Because in our first episode, we took, we spoke to two people from La Via Campesina and they already talked a lot about, you know, showing the practices, sharing the practices. It is, I mean, it is biology. It is. social fabric. It's all these things together. And, um, so, so it really circles back to, to the first conversation I had of this series, as well as the politics of inequality that we discussed in, in, in the third episode, which is that this knowledge is often not being recognized. There's not enough space for it. There's not a lot of investment in it. So yeah. I would have liked to be there.

Solomé: I would love for you to visit. And you know, what was also mind blowing is they started with this pilot center and now they've. Building 14 others because at this point for other farmers from neighboring countries are having to come into Casamance, Senegal to get the training or to learn and they said we need to build it in their communities and they need to run it themselves and and that's what community based movement solutions look like, right?

They build power at every level of the way and it was really powerful and it was also so powerful to see the different communities. Yeah. Stakeholders, they bring in right and organize the village chief and the mayor were with us. They were visiting with us. I've never heard a mayor speaks as fluently about agroecology, it's a fact as I did that day, but it's because of intentional work that they're doing. They're not just Organizing farmers. They're not just doing scientific research. They're also doing policy advocacy. They're also shifting politics at the municipal and national level. And this is the kind of intersectional solutions that movements provide that's The many in the philanthropy sector just don't fully appreciate it yet.

Barbara: Yeah. Yeah. Thank you so much. And we'll definitely share some resources in the show notes for people that want to learn more about this work. I'm wondering, because you talked earlier a little bit about some of the kind of ethical questions or challenges that you face as a funder. Um, and, uh, and also, yeah, and also strategic questions. and We are in a particular context of, you know, a global crisis in, in many ways, you also referred to it, um, with a lot of factors affecting food sovereignty, uh, from, the political context to climate to, conflict in many places. And I'm wondering if you could say a little bit about what are some of those big ethical and strategic questions that maybe you're You know, you've grappled with, or you're sitting with at the moment, or you see others struggling with, and what are some of the conversations you might be having with others around these choices.

Solome: Yeah, absolutely. I think, we are, as you said, in these trying times, right, both with, um, rise in autocratic authoritarian leadership around the world, but also conflicts around the world. There's over 100 conflicts that are kind of active in some shape or form right now. And I think for funders, um, and even just for us, a thousand currents at this moment, what we're thinking about is what does it mean for us to make sure we support communities. In a way that is sustained in long term, and that allows them to realize their long term visions of autonomy of a life of dignity of equality and so forth. That is the priority driving factor for us, right? And so we are not, for example, a conflict funder at Thousand Currents, but our partners live in places of conflict. And because of that, we do what we need to do, which is providing the immediate emergency support they need to respond to the current needs, but then double down on our commitments to the long term investment they need, um, because often that our attention and the public for, uh, feeds right after a year or two or three, but actually that's when rebuilding happens. That's when they need the investment. And so for a thousand currents, We've made a commitment that we're endless for the long haul, and we will accompany communities for the long haul. In many ways, the struggles that they are facing everywhere from Congo to Sudan to Palestine to many other places are long years in the making, and they'll be long years. Right. Um, for us to take time for us to fully transform them. And so it's for us.. And it's really important that philanthropy really thinks about where people, where communities, what do they need and how do we get resources directly to them?

Barbara: Yeah. Yeah. Thank you so much for that. We started this podcast during kind of COVID, um, peak, um, pandemic. And these, these similar questions came up a lot, right? What happens with all good intentions when crisis hits or, um, and, and it's exactly in those moments, I think that, that very clear intentionality around, um, who you're funding and how's so important.

Um, so thank you for sharing that. Um, I'm wondering, some, one of the things, and you talked a bit about accompaniments, some, something that came up in earlier conversations was this real interest to also come together as movements, um, learn from each other, strategize together. there, we, we spoke to a, a corporate campaign actually in Europe that said, if only we could mobilize this collective intelligence of those that kind of study the, the system from, the, the kind of corporate powers in the system to those doing the, the work on the ground. Do you have any experience or thoughts on what you and others also could do to foster that kind of exchange and cross learning and, really bringing that collective intelligence and strategizing.

Solome: Absolutely, absolutely. That is a core and integral part of our work in terms of bringing partners together in the form of learning exchanges, whether it's around specific issues like at Agroecology Learning Exchange or a particular place, whether it's Nepal or a region, but, but creating spaces where they come together is, is Is critical, and we've heard it repeatedly from partners over the years. How that's also necessary for them. Um, COVID shifted things a little for many of us, right? And at least for us at Thousand Currents, we weren't able to do that to the same degree. And recently, over the past few months, part of the reason why we had a hard time scheduling this is we've been doing consultations with partners, both regional and cross regional consultations, and we heard the same thing you just said from partners. We need these spaces, particularly in this moments where we come together. Um, and so these, these convenings, these spaces for dialogue aren't just events right or experiences their strategies for the work. And that's how we need to engage them as funders and how how we need to resource them. So, for 1000 currents, it's, it's a core part of our work.

And, and. We're in the strategic refresh process, and again, it remains central, perhaps even more of a focus, particularly in these times when there are different types of attacks in civil society organizations and movement formations, it's particularly important that we invest in their ability to, to engage in collective analysis, collective strategy and collective visioning.

Barbara: Yeah, thanks for that. Um, I mean, that's really meaningful. And it's actually part of the reason we started this podcast. Uh, because at the same time, of course, people often don't, even if everyone feels it's needed, it's hard to actually create that space unless you have someone saying, okay, I'm going to help you do that. Um, so yeah, that's really, really powerful.

Solome: It's powerful, right? And I think the one thing that's, As funders, we need to hold and recognize when we create these spaces, sometimes we can be outcomes driven. We create it so that we can have a particular outcome, and we want to disassociate that, right? We actually create powerful spaces, um, that the vision is to be that movements coming together and the outcomes coming together. Be whatever it is that they articulate this in the site moving forward. That's when actually we have the most impact. Not when we're driving the convening or when we're forcing it, right? We can't. It has to come from movements and they have to vision and articulate the process and outcome in the way that they want to see it.

And at least for 1000 currents. That's when we've been moved, right? We've brought partners together in Nepal just so they get to know one another. Um, and without a particular expectation, but one of the outcomes from there was a group that worked primarily on women's economic empowerment realized they didn't have a strong youth focus and a strong climate focus. And a group that works primarily on youth climate justice realized they didn't have a strong gender focus. Um, and so they've been collaborating since 2018, 2019, right? And that can only happen when it's self driven and initiated, uh, and mutual, not when we as funders drive it, but what we can do. through our resources, both in terms of our funding grants, but also in creating these convening spaces, is just create the enabling conditions, create the conditions, their movement won't run away with it.

Barbara: Yeah. And I hope many funders are listening in on this. Um, yeah, because I, this is totally my experience as well. Uh, that not having that fixed agenda creates so much space for actual learning and connections. Yeah, impact. Um, so thank you for that, we're gonna go towards rounding up. Um, and I'm wondering, um, if there are things that you would like to, what, yeah, what are some of the things you would, you hope to see maybe in the coming year or so? Or if there are any things that you would like to share with others in terms of what they can do to support, um, this type of work, um, to be in solidarity, whether they are funders or, or activists or researchers or we have a range of, um, people listening to this podcast, what would you like to give, um, Or invite people to do.

Solomé: yeah, this year's going to be interesting. I'm really excited about the Nyelani forum that's coming up. in 2007 movements came together to really articulate this vision for food sovereignty and agroecology as a pathway and so forth. And I'm excited what will come out of this. And it gives us, whether we're academics or funders, whoever we are, an opportunity to really hear it. Listen to it. Accompany movement visions once again. So I'm excited about that. Um, and in terms of what folks can do, I think, regardless of your positionality, the first thing is to identify and support local groups and movements, either in your immediate community or in communities you care about, right, that are working for food, justice and food sovereignty. See how you can support them. Um, that is something we can all do in our own ways. And support is not always financial, right? It could be your talent, time and treasure. But how can you support them? Um, and secondly, I think, um, We are more than happy at Thousand Currents to be a resource to anybody, right, who's interested in learning about and connecting to movements.

And so join us, check out the website, thousandcurrents.org, sign up for emails, and there will be more opportunities and more ways to learn about the work through that as well.

Thank you so much, Solomé. Is there anything else you'd like to share, um, as part of this conversation? Just thank you for having me and thank you for creating space and holding the space for these critical conversations. Well, thank you so much for sharing your time and wisdom with us, um, and for reminding us of the powerful work that's happening at community level, in movements, when it comes to food sovereignty and many of the related issues, um, and, uh, and the importance of educating both ourselves and, and others maybe, um, to be able to, to really let this work grow, um, and make systemic change.

So thank you. Thank you so much. so much.

Thank you for listening to the People vs Inequality Podcast. We hope you enjoyed the episode, please leave a review and know that we are looking for funding in case you are or know of any funder. Do get in touch!